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oneye said:
Donovan’s best trait that Hayward didn’t have is that Donovan isn’t afraid to try and fail. He’s not afraid to shoot and miss, and miss again, and miss again, and then take the next shot with full confidence and not a worry about it. Teammates literally throw Donovan the ball with like 2 seconds left on the shot clock 3 feet outside the 3 point line all the time and he has to jack up a shot. He doesn’t worry about percentages, or the fact it isn’t a real high percentage shot he is forced into at times, he takes it and rolls with whatever happens without blinking.

Donovan is “that guy” who has no problem with it being on him, and with how often he switches off to point in 4th quarters and has the ball in his hands to make decisions it shows the confidence both he and the coaches have in him. He isn’t the guy who’s going to give Joe Johnson the ball to close out a game, he will step up and do it..... as a rookie. Hayward wanted the fame and no blame. Donovan wants it all.
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I think Hayward's biggest issue is that he has as much charisma as an avocado and was never "all in" on Utah. The on court stuff DM brings is straight duck nuts, but the off court stuff (commitment, leadership, and likeability) are equally exciting. Someday I can see an all-star level player saying he came here to play with DM and Rudy... I don't know that Hayward could/would ever help in that way.

I think we were a mid-50 win team under Hayward... Under DM not much will shock me.
 
oneye said:
Donovan’s best trait that Hayward didn’t have is that Donovan isn’t afraid to try and fail. He’s not afraid to shoot and miss, and miss again, and miss again, and then take the next shot with full confidence and not a worry about it. Teammates literally throw Donovan the ball with like 2 seconds left on the shot clock 3 feet outside the 3 point line all the time and he has to jack up a shot. He doesn’t worry about percentages, or the fact it isn’t a real high percentage shot he is forced into at times, he takes it and rolls with whatever happens without blinking.

Donovan is “that guy” who has no problem with it being on him, and with how often he switches off to point in 4th quarters and has the ball in his hands to make decisions it shows the confidence both he and the coaches have in him. He isn’t the guy who’s going to give Joe Johnson the ball to close out a game, he will step up and do it..... as a rookie. Hayward wanted the fame and no blame. Donovan wants it all.
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We finally have our alpha in Mitchell and is why Gordon will never be a first option on a great team.

Mitchell also already has a higher career assist per game average than Haywood. 3.5 vs 3.4. Mitchell has 2.7 tos vs 2.0 toss. But yeah he's not afraid of failure, for one because he doesn't need to be coddled.
 
oneye said:
The greatest story line one day would be meeting Boston with Hayward in the finals....and watching Donovan kill him. I pray that this will play out at some point years down the road.
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How much of a fight would he even put up?

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Points in regular season for a Jazz rookie :
1 Darrell Griffith 1671 Pts
2 Donovan Mitchell 1230 Pts
3 Karl Malone 1203 Pts

Points in regular season for a rookie since 2010 :
1 Blake Griffin 1845 Pts
2 Damian Lillard 1562 Pts
3 KAT 1503 Pts
8 Donovan Mitchell 1230 Pts

Points in regular season for a pick 13 rookie :
1 Donovan Mitchell 1230 Pts
2 Karl Malone 1203 Pts
3 Devin Booker 1048 Pts

Projection for DM at the end of the season : 1570 Pts
 
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oneye said:
The greatest story line one day would be meeting Boston with Hayward in the finals....and watching Donovan kill him. I pray that this will play out at some point years down the road.
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Screw that. I’m hoping Boston crashes and burns in fiery glory. I hope they never advance as far as the Jazz do while Ainge, Stevens and Hayward are all there. East are a bunch of ***** teams. I don’t even want them to sniff the finals.
 
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Update on Most 3 point makes by a Rookie:

1.) Damian Lillard (12/13) - 185
2.) Steph Curry (09/10) - 166
3.) Rudy Fernandez (08/09) - 159

Donovan Mitchell (17/18) - with three more 3 pointers tonight brings his total to 150.

Needs 10 to take 3rd, 17 to take 2nd and 36 to take over 1st.

16 games left to go. He needs to average 2.25 per game to do that. He’s been averaging 2.6 per game (on 7.3 attempts) since the win streak began.
 
oneye said:
The greatest story line one day would be meeting Boston with Hayward in the finals....and watching Donovan kill him. I pray that this will play out at some point years down the road.
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By the time it happens, nobody except the hardcore fans will remember. And most of us will be more interested in the Celtic Pride angle, anyway.
 
gandalfe said:
By the time it happens, nobody except the hardcore fans will remember. And most of us will be more interested in the Celtic Pride angle, anyway.
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No, we'll remember, it's not like Hayward will be around for 50 years.
 
Update on Most 3 point makes by a Rookie:

1.) Damian Lillard, Portland (12/13) - 185
2.) Steph Curry, GSW (09/10) - 166
3.) Rudy Fernandez, Portland (08/09) - 159
4.) Kerry Kittles, New Jersey (96/97) - 158
5.) Juan Carlos Navarro, Memphis (07/08) - 156
6.) Allen Iverson, Philly (96/97) - 155
7.) Matt Maloney, Houston (96/97) - 154
8.) Donovan Mitchell, Utah (17/18) - 153

Donovan Mitchell (17/18) - with three more 3 pointers tonight brings his total to 153.

Needs 7 to take 3rd, 14 to take 2nd and 33 to take over 1st.

15 games left to go. He needs to average 2.2 per game to do that. He’s been averaging 2.6 per game (on 7.3 attempts) since the win streak began.

Also, Mitchell got to 150 five games before Lillard did his rookie season. Unreal.
 
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oneye said:
The greatest story line one day would be meeting Boston with Hayward in the finals....and watching Donovan kill him. I pray that this will play out at some point years down the road.
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Literally kill him. That would be sweet.
 
Updated my last post to include the other 4 guys who have made more 3’s than Mitchell in their rookie seasons. He could very likely pass a couple of them in his next game - including AI.

96/97 was a banner year for rookie threes. 3 of the top 7 guys (Kittles, Iverson, Maloney) all did it during that season. That’s insane.
 
Ellis269 said:
Screw that. I’m hoping Boston crashes and burns in fiery glory. I hope they never advance as far as the Jazz do while Ainge, Stevens and Hayward are all there. East are a bunch of ***** teams. I don’t even want them to sniff the finals.
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If.... wait, no no, WHEN we eventually make the Finals I would love to see Boston as our opponent so I can watch Donovan and Rudy absolutely destroy Haywood. Haywood succumbing to the realization that he ****ed up in leaving a great thing and Danny Ainge crumbling in the realization that he failed would be GLORIOUS. That would be far more painful for them than it would for them to never come close. It would be so sweet to see Haywood watch us celebrate after the way he treated the fans, coaches and ownership on the way out the door.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I think Hayward's biggest issue is that he has as much charisma as an avocado and was never "all in" on Utah. The on court stuff DM brings is straight duck nuts, but the off court stuff (commitment, leadership, and likeability) are equally exciting. Someday I can see an all-star level player saying he came here to play with DM and Rudy... I don't know that Hayward could/would ever help in that way.

I think we were a mid-50 win team under Hayward... Under DM not much will shock me.
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Never happened with Stockton or Malone. And Deron stated that was his goal. Ultimately I think that's why Williams wouldn't commit as an upcoming FA; he had likely talked with others about coming to Utah and none wanted to. I think it's more likely stars would invite Mitchell to leave for a bigger market in 7 years and join THEM, not the other way around. Jazz may get aging guys like JJ, but I'm going to be extremely surprised to see an all-star in his prime end up in Utah. But we can dream.

Or DL can go after guys like Mirotic, who did want to join the Jazz. Or this gen's versions of Okur and Boozer, players who were underutilized by their teams and looking for bigger roles.
 
DownUnder said:
the best thing about Donovan is that i pretty much haven't thought of Hayward one bit since December ..
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This is a low key, great take.
The decimation that seemingly was pervading all things Jazz last offseason have almost been eradicated from history.
 
Piso said:
Points in regular season for a Jazz rookie :
1 Darrell Griffith 1671 Pts
2 Donovan Mitchell 1230 Pts
3 Karl Malone 1203 Pts

Points in regular season for a rookie since 2010 :
1 Blake Griffin 1845 Pts
2 Damian Lillard 1562 Pts
3 KAT 1503 Pts
8 Donovan Mitchell 1230 Pts

Points in regular season for a pick 13 rookie :
1 Donovan Mitchell 1230 Pts
2 Karl Malone 1203 Pts
3 Devin Booker 1048 Pts

Projection for DM at the end of the season : 1570 Pts
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Great numbers.
My only question about DM's development is where to from here? He doesn't have to go really much further to be an amazing player - but I am wondering if he will struggle to take significant incremental steps because of the high standards he has set for himself already and because he plays massive minutes as the scoring leader on a playoff team? How many rookies have had the opportunity (not taking away the fact he forced the coaching stafff's hand) to take as many shots as he has had and to play the amount of minutes he has?
Surely it will be difficult for him to make leaps moving forward.... Maybe improved shooting % off the dribble and more focus on defense?
 
Et tu Brute said:
Great numbers.
My only question about DM's development is where to from here? He doesn't have to go really much further to be an amazing player - but I am wondering if he will struggle to take significant incremental steps because of the high standards he has set for himself already and because he plays massive minutes as the scoring leader on a playoff team? How many rookies have had the opportunity (not taking away the fact he forced the coaching stafff's hand) to take as many shots as he has had and to play the amount of minutes he has?
Surely it will be difficult for him to make leaps moving forward.... Maybe improved shooting % off the dribble and more focus on defense?
Click to expand...

This is the one thing I wouldn't worry about, at least from DM. His work ethic would make Sloan pop a basketboner and he is always improving. He'll use the experience he's gained thus far and learn from it, like when to dish, when to shoot, and when to drive. His assists have steadily improved over the last few months as a case in point. The Jazz have to figure out is how to best surround DM and Gobert to make their lives easier.
 
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