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Question Regarding Politics and Religion

Boris said:
Forgive Boris for I forget you young pups were not educated in history. You probably do not even know who JFK is let alone that him being a Catholic was a huge deal an moral victory for the Vatican. Oh, excuse me again. The Vatican is the Roman Home an seat of the Catholic faith. JFK got assassinated for being Catholic did you know that?

More recently, President Obama was both the first black person AND the first Muslim to become president. I can explain to you youngins that both of those are MORAL VICTORIES that should be celebrated regardless of POLITICAL PERSPECTIVE.

I can hate Obama an still appreciate a country WILLING to finally appoint a black man! What is so hard to understand about that?
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Obama is about as Muslim as I am. About as black as I am too but that's another matter. Anyway everybody knows Elvis shot JFK over a gambling debt.
 
The Obama is a Muslim also made 0 sense to me.

1. He's not

2. Even if he secretly was, I do not care. It makes 0 difference.
 
Stoked said:
The Obama is a Muslim also made 0 sense to me.

1. He's not

2. Even if he secretly was, I do not care. It makes 0 difference.
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Indeed, and as a secret Muslim double agent he sure killed a lot of other Muslims... That there are people in the world who believe this **** makes my head spin, it also drives me ****ing insane that there are politicians out there that so morally bankrupt that they will attempt to exploit these people and their lack of rationality for their vote. I live in a country where voting is compulsory so i make a point not to vote, for a large number of reasons but one is that if my vote is worth as much as someone who isn't engaged in the process and can be duped by arseholes, whats the point?
 
JustTheTip said:
But where do you draw the line? People say we can't legislate morality, but how do you not? We legislate murder, theft, rape, minimum wage, what type of healthcare (bc healthcare for all for their health benefit is a moral issue), etc.
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thta is why libertarianism is the only moral option!


the line is drawn where the individual line is!



if you murder someone you encroach on his life! and self defense!
if you rape someone you encroach on his/her liberty and self defense
when you steal you encroach on his/her property and self defense


minimum wage is ********
stealing money from 1 person is immoral wether u use it for a moral case(healthcare) doesnt matter!


so that is where you draw the line
life, liberty, right to property, and self defense
 
LogGrad98 said:
To me this is more interesting from the standpoint of our representative government. Does an atheist politician represent his constituency if most of them are religious? Can a muslim politician represent a largely Christian populace? Or can one religious sect, that derides another (say southern baptist vs mormons, or something) represent that faction within their constituency?

Also, asking anyone to leave some core facet of their personality out of their decision-making is like asking a white guy to not be white, but only in these certain circumstances. A core belief will ALWAYS influence someone in their decisions, even if only subconsciously, be it religious or whatever.
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Good post.
Interesting thoughts
 
Stoked said:
The Obama is a Muslim also made 0 sense to me.

1. He's not

2. Even if he secretly was, I do not care. It makes 0 difference.
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it should make a difference! as Islam is all about domination! submit to allah and sharia law!


islam is a political system!
 
Rubashov said:
Indeed, and as a secret Muslim double agent he sure killed a lot of other Muslims
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most muslims are killed byu other muslims!

always making this stupid argument he killed muslims so he cant be muslims. not syaing ihe is one or is neot

but your argument is baseless
 
Stoked said:
If this is your measuring stick then why hate Bush? He had some of these qualities. To me at least. The biggest hit he would have is being well spoken. There is more than one way to show these attributes.

They are things that I like in a president as well.
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Because bush sounded like an idiot.
Whenever he spoke in public I got the feeling that I would score higher on an sat or act test than he would.... and I'm not all that smart. (No college degree, didn't graduate from my high school)

I want my president to be smarter than most and at least smarter than me....... or at the very least he should seem smarter than most and come across that way.

It's just my opinion but bush seemed like a dumbass to me whenever he spoke.


I did like that Bush seemed like he was caring and confident though.
 
Rubashov said:
Are you arguing against murder, rape and theft being crimes? If so carry on, if not its not really an argument. Healthcare, welfare all these sorts of things are matter of public policy, I don't see them a necessarily religious, they only become so over issues like abortion and euthanasia, which in my humble opinion are personal choices and nobody elses.

As an aside you see all these right to life nutcases carry on about abortions, where were they during anti war protests?
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Probably the same place most anti war protestors were during the anti abortion protests.

Other than that nice post lol
 
fishonjazz said:
Because bush sounded like an idiot.
Whenever he spoke in public I got the feeling that I would score higher on an sat or act test than he would.... and I'm not all that smart. (No college degree, didn't graduate from my high school)

I want my president to be smarter than most and at least smarter than me....... or at the very least he should seem smarter than most and come across that way.

It's just my opinion but bush seemed like a dumbass to me whenever he spoke.


I did like that Bush seemed like he was caring and confident though.
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I give you that. His accent and pace of speech made him seem unintelligent. But that is actually far from the truth.

But my point was is that one thing enough to negate the other things you value which he had? Mostly curious.
 
A couple of people here seem to think that it is only moral legislation if it is someone else's morality that is being enforced. Theirs is just common sense!

Politics are ALL about moral legislation. Pro-choice politicians force one view of morality on every one else, and pro-lifers try to enforce another.

As for my vote, it would depend on their stances and my options. It is unlikely that I'd vote for a "fundamentalist Christian", since they are likely to operate from a socially regressive outlook. But I would still judge them the way I judge anyone else; on the substance of their ideas.
 
fishonjazz said:
Because bush sounded like an idiot.
Whenever he spoke in public I got the feeling that I would score higher on an sat or act test than he would.... and I'm not all that smart. (No college degree, didn't graduate from my high school)

I want my president to be smarter than most and at least smarter than me....... or at the very least he should seem smarter than most and come across that way.

It's just my opinion but bush seemed like a dumbass to me whenever he spoke.


I did like that Bush seemed like he was caring and confident though.
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He was actually quite intelligent, he just spoke like an average person.
 
Siro said:
A couple of people here seem to think that it is only moral legislation if it is someone else's morality that is being enforced. Theirs is just common sense!

Politics are ALL about moral legislation. Pro-choice politicians force one view of morality on every one else, and pro-lifers try to enforce another.

As for my vote, it would depend on their stances and my options. It is unlikely that I'd vote for a "fundamentalist Christian", since they are likely to operate from a socially regressive outlook. But I would still judge them the way I judge anyone else; on the substance of their ideas.
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I think this is where I stand as well. Obviously being a fundamental Christian I'm more likely to vote for one, but I try to accept counter ideas as well. It's hard, I won't lie. I'm against drug use for example. So do I support legislation that is more in line with my religion, or what I think lines up with our constitution? Personally I value my religion far more than politics, but there is the question of whether I should even care about politics?

It's also important to realize that no policy is perfect. In fact, every policy will hurt somebody. So the idea that we should legislate based on ideas that don't hurt people is unrealistic. I'm not sure there's a clear cut answer either. That's why I struggle with it.
 
Stoked said:
I give you that. His accent and pace of speech made him seem unintelligent. But that is actually far from the truth.

But my point was is that one thing enough to negate the other things you value which he had? Mostly curious.
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Good question. I guess it would depend on who the other options for president were.

If it's bush vs trump then I can look past bush sounding like a dumbass when speaking in public.
 
JustTheTip said:
He was actually quite intelligent, he just spoke like an average person.
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Yes I'm sure he was. He sounded like an idiot though. I prefer my president to not sound like an idiot and so that factors into how I would vote. (I have only ever actually voted one time though, when trump was running, so it doesn't really matter much anyway. I just listed some characteristics that I like to see from the president of the US. Sounding intelligent when speaking with world leaders is desirable imo)
 
fishonjazz said:
I mostly look for a president who seems intelligent, classy, well spoken, caring, and confident. (Reasons I liked obama and hated george w and hate trump)
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Trump checks off nothing from my list btw.
 
DutchJazzer said:
it should make a difference! as Islam is all about domination! submit to allah and sharia law!


islam is a political system!
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In a system designed for checks on that power it makes zero difference. I do not care that you view Islam as a political system. That changes nothing about what a President can and cannot do.

So basically stop trying to fear monger. It will not work with me.
 
I think I would really really really like george bush to hang out with and go fishing with or something.
I would probably like him more than any other president in history on a personal level.
 
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