Roe v. Wade is going down

[BabyPeterzz]

while others choose to enslave the women for the sake of fetuses, even non-viable ones.

Which is why they will continue to lose. Slow learners.


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[silesian]

A fetus and a child are the same thing.

I have questions.

how is it that the microsecond before conception it is okay to terminate while the microsecond after conception it is murder?

And isn’t killing sperm or egg that would have impregnated a woman stopping a human life? If your parents had practiced birth control you would never have existed.

How is a god who murders all first born Egyptians considered pro life?

 

[str8line]

As someone who is strongly in the pro-life camp, I’m disappointed with the result in Ohio but I’m content that it was the people of the state of Ohio who made the decision. It wasn’t mandated by an unelected Supreme Court, nor was it done at the federal level. The Tenth Amendment should forbid either the Supreme Court or Congress from weighing in on abortion. All states should have absolute say over that issue even if it means some will choose to enshrine a right for women to murder their own children.

The flesh you so fancifully fry / Is not succulent, tasty or kind / It's death for no reason / And death for no reason is murder

 

[fishonjazz]

while others choose to enslave the women for the sake of fetuses, even non-viable ones.

Afew years back a friend of mine murdered his own mom when he took her off life support. Didnt even go to jail. ****ing marxist socialist leftist communist pedophilic satanists.


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[Al-O-Meter]

how is it that the microsecond before conception it is okay to terminate while the microsecond after conception it is murder?

If you are talking about abstract things like ideas and plans, or tangible things like humans, the word 'conception' mean to bring into existence. Your question is asking the difference between destroying a thing doesn't exist versus destroying a thing that does exist. One is ending a human life while the other is only averting potential. I certainly don't equate the ending of an existing, "concieved" human life and the destruction of what is nothing other than what could possibly be, but I also don't see the latter as entirely inconsequential, a thing to be dismissed as "okay". I think that is what has driven the societal norms of insisting that women and children go on the lifeboats first, and Hamas making claims over how many Palestinian women and children were killed to garner sympathy for their cause. The potential of future generations is not without value.

 

[One Brow]

One is ending a human life while the other is only averting potential.

Gametes from humans are 1) human, 2) alive, and 3) separate and individual. Killing a human sperm/ovum is killing a human life. Your dividing line is as arbitrary as anyone else's.

 

[LogGrad98]

As someone who is strongly in the pro-life camp, I’m disappointed with the result in Ohio but I’m content that it was the people of the state of Ohio who made the decision. It wasn’t mandated by an unelected Supreme Court, nor was it done at the federal level. The Tenth Amendment should forbid either the Supreme Court or Congress from weighing in on abortion. All states should have absolute say over that issue even if it means some will choose to enshrine a right for women to murder their own children.

while others choose to enslave the women for the sake of fetuses, even non-viable ones.

Eh, I think you're both wrong, but each is entitled to their own, etc. but I just know I'm not the one who is affected so I'm not the one who should be making the decision one way or the other. Let the mother decide. The state (both the State and the states) rarely knows best, so they should butt out.

 

[LogGrad98]

I have questions.

how is it that the microsecond before conception it is okay to terminate while the microsecond after conception it is murder?

And isn’t killing sperm or egg that would have impregnated a woman stopping a human life? If your parents had practiced birth control you would never have existed.

How is a god who murders all first born Egyptians considered pro life?

God said in the Bible that man should not spill his seed on the ground. So apparently the God of the old testament agrees that sperm are holy.

 

[LogGrad98]

Gametes from humans are 1) human, 2) alive, and 3) separate and individual. Killing a human sperm/ovum is killing a human life. Your dividing line is as arbitrary as anyone else's.

Yeah but to be fair once they come together they make an entirely new thing. So there is that.

 

[Al-O-Meter]

I just know I'm not the one who is affected so I'm not the one who should be making the decision one way or the other. Let the mother decide. The state (both the State and the states) rarely knows best, so they should butt out.

With that point of view, should any murder be prosecuted? Seeing as you seem to believe the one murdered doesn’t get a say, and it is the murderer who is the one affected by being prosecuted for murder, should the state butt out in all cases where one human kills another?

 

[Sardines]

We make life and death choices all the time. As a society, as individuals, as independent groups. Human life has finite value at any stage of existence, and it is especially low in value when it is a fetus. I support abortion rights because I think a pregnant woman's feelings about her pregnancy are more important than a fetus. If she values the existence of the fetus then it is she who has given that fetus value. The fetus has no inherent value to me at all.

 

[LogGrad98]

With that point of view, should any murder be prosecuted? Seeing as you seem to believe the one murdered doesn’t get a say, and it is the murderer who is the one affected by being prosecuted for murder, should the state butt out in all cases where one human kills another?

See that's where you're wrong. But that's ok. The definitions matter, and it's in these that we can't get consensus. Until we can all agree on exactly when that definition applies to a fetus we act on what is commonly legally accepted now. So your argument is only valid in that everyone agrees with your definition, and they obviously don't. So it's pointless to take that approach in this context.

It also shows you know nothing at all about my position, but thanks for presuming. You'll fit in well with all the nut-jobs protesting outside abortion clinics calling everyone who walks through the door a whore with zero knowledge of their individual situations.

 

[One Brow]

With that point of view, should any murder be prosecuted? Seeing as you seem to believe the one murdered doesn’t get a say, and it is the murderer who is the one affected by being prosecuted for murder, should the state butt out in all cases where one human kills another?

We also have justifiable homicide for self-defense. If I were making the changes in your body similar to the changes from a pregnancy, and you had no other way to stop me, it would be a justified homicide.

 

[Al-O-Meter]

We also have justifiable homicide for self-defense. If I were making the changes in your body similar to the changes from a pregnancy, and you had no other way to stop me, it would be a justified homicide.

You have a hilariously backwards view. It isn't the fetus that is pregnant. It isn't the fetus secreting all the hormones that change a woman's body. It is the woman's body, and in nearly every case it is the result of an act the woman chose to commit. The one who had no choice universally in the conception process is the same one LogGrad thinks should have no say when being murdered.

 

[LogGrad98]

You have a hilariously backwards view. It isn't the fetus that is pregnant. It isn't the fetus secreting all the hormones that change a woman's body. It is the woman's body, and in nearly every case it is the result of an act the woman chose to commit. The one who had no choice universally in the conception process is the same one LogGrad thinks should have no say when being murdered.

Yeah you didn't even read a thing I said. And you didn't ask. I always knew you were intellectually dishonest, just more evidence of the same. Go search my name and abortion and read some of the huge arguments OB and I got into about this very topic. And then go ahead and **** off. If you refuse to do that search then feel free to never mention my name again. *******.

 

[fishonjazz]

With that point of view, should any murder be prosecuted? Seeing as you seem to believe the one murdered doesn’t get a say, and it is the murderer who is the one affected by being prosecuted for murder, should the state butt out in all cases where one human kills another?

With that point of view if someone takes their dying family member off life support should that person and doctor be put in prison for the rest of their lives. Abortion, murder, taking someone off life support, ejaculation/masturbation, its all the same and is all ending human life. There is no difference.


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[fishonjazz]

We make life and death choices all the time. As a society, as individuals, as independent groups. Human life has finite value at any stage of existence, and it is especially low in value when it is a fetus. I support abortion rights because I think a pregnant woman's feelings about her pregnancy are more important than a fetus. If she values the existence of the fetus then it is she who has given that fetus value. The fetus has no inherent value to me at all.

Great post


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[fishonjazz]

You have a hilariously backwards view. It isn't the fetus that is pregnant. It isn't the fetus secreting all the hormones that change a woman's body. It is the woman's body, and in nearly every case it is the result of an act the woman chose to commit. The one who had no choice universally in the conception process is the same one LogGrad thinks should have no say when being murdered.

Nearly is a tricky word


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[Al-O-Meter]

Yeah you didn't even read a thing I said. And you didn't ask. I always knew you were intellectually dishonest, just more evidence of the same. Go search my name and abortion and read some of the huge arguments OB and I got into about this very topic. And then go ahead and **** off. If you refuse to do that search then feel free to never mention my name again. *******.

I read everything you say in response to one of my posts but expecting that I go back to search for everything you've ever written, ever, is ridiculous. And you were responding to a comment I made to OneBrow, not you. The biggest fault I see in your thinking is that you outsource your own morals. An act is right or wrong because she thinks it is, or because of what consensus says. It is all someone else. It is all go along to get along. There is no ownership.

Is it a good thing if your family, friends, and neighbors are more likely to be a victim of crime? Without looking around to see what everyone else thinks, is a rising crime rate a good thing? How about rising divorce rates? Do you think it is a good thing when families split apart and lawyers take a third of everything that couple has built over their lives? Do you want to see more of that? How about suicide rate? Do you have an opinion of your own on the health of a society that increasingly chooses to kill themselves. Do you think children raised by single mothers do better at life than children raised in two-parent households? The data on all of this is absolutely damning.

While I don't agree with the prescriptions this guy makes at the conclusion of his video, his examination of the data is very good.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sp_rgqRugho

 

[Al-O-Meter]

Nearly is a tricky word

It is, and it is also why there are carve-outs for those instances in nearly every piece of legislation. The dishonest side is the one claiming because those instances exist that all women should be able to kill their own children.