Agreed, a hell a lot of other years he'd have been a shot at making all rookie 2nd team. i can see him developing to the point where he starts and Joe moves to a Manu style role in two or three years.
Rolls Royce
- Thread starter JazzMan4Life
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Agreed, a hell a lot of other years he'd have been a shot at making all rookie 2nd team. i can see him developing to the point where he starts and Joe moves to a Manu style role in two or three years.
NAOS
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Currently, the best shot our offense produces is one taken by Joe Ingles. And seeing that during last year he was still on an upward trajectory, he isn't going anywhere.
NAOS
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The best thing for loyalty would be for them to decline next year so that they can give him a raise on a longer deal.
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I'm not sure why people think Joe could or should come off the bench long term. He's like the perfect glue starter. Great bench guys are generally guys that get their own like Lou Williams and Manu (though both can create for others they are very good at getting their own shot).
I'm not advocating for Joe to go to the bench now or in the near future, I just see Royce if he continues to develop as his long term replacement at the 3. Joe at 34/35 coming off the bench and able to play 3 positions would be handy. I also think Joe at the moment has a better feel for the game when he starts, seems to have a better rhythm than when he comes off the bench. I think much like Manu Joe can probably play as long as he wants providing his body holds up, its not like he has any quickness to lose.
When Donovan gets paid in a couple of years the bench might not be as deep. It might end up a pretty close to 8 man rotation due to contracts. (I could be completely out of my mind but i don't think its beyond the realms of whats possible.)
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With Royce I believe we could extend him next year to the average salary or like 110% of the MLE... roughly like 4/40 or 4/45 with increases. It is the deal that Josh Richardson and Norman Powell got. If he continues to improve that would be justified.
I like Royce a lot, but he will be restricted and we should keep him at his current salary. We can lock him up long term and I think loyalty is a two way street... we gave him an opportunity, a contract, and helped him develop.
We could have max cap space this summer or next if we want to... Royce, DM, Joe, and Jae all on value deals (and Rudy... just good value at a high number) we have to capitalize on that flexibility. We could also do front loaded deals for Rubio (8% declines) and do a renegotiate and extend with Royce (similar to Robert Covington) but that takes up our space and needs to be a bargain on the back end of the deal to make it worth it.
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That makes more sense. I'd still keep Joe in a starting role personally, but just less minutes. I think as a shooter, passer, and overall smart player he really enhances what our best players do. We might need more creators off the bench long term... I'm not sure Joe will be a creator at that point and I'd want a guy in that role that has more ability to create his own shot.
Sure people recognize that for stars, but not for role players (in my opinion). If you ask the average Jazz fan how they like having Royce on the team I doubt that many of them would mention his great contract.
NAOS
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So what you said is based completely on speculation (i.e. your opinion of the "average jazz fan"), not on actual conversations?
NAOS
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If we don't attract a max-level star, then I'd be shocked if they don't spend the money on Ricky and Royce. In this scenario, as regards to Royce, you can probably get better terms by spending more, sooner.
If Ricky plays this year like he did the last half of last year, whats he worth? He's on 15 now, 17 to 20? Those last 3 months he went for 16ppg, 5 assists and 5 boards and he's only 27. Additionally, say you let him go, who would you replace him with? i'd be shocked if Ricky doesn't come back after this year but at what price? The real question is does Favors come back? I think he does.
In terms of Royce I'd definitely offer him the sort of number that Thabo is getting for next season maybe on a two year deal as an act of good faith. Easy to do of course when its not your money you're spending.