The Jazz rebuild
- Thread starter @nsanba
- Start date
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
Yeah, without a decent shot at jumping into the top 3, I might have to jump off the tank. Tanking to draft at 8 is quick road to nowhere. I think half the team has been looking a little run down lately. It's probably not Ebola, but to be on the safe side, better quarantine them for a month or two. Time to this chit to get real.
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If the Jazz don't believe they're going to have a decent shot at top 3, they might as well just forget about tanking.
spycam1
Well-Known Member
The Jazz were one of the teams that voted against the lottery change, so maybe they did (and still do) believe they'll be in the bottom 3 (or close to it) come season's end.
Jazz4ever
Well-Known Member
Guess it depends on "decent".
4th gets you a 37.8% of moving into the top 3.
5th gets you 29.2%
Now lets say the Jazz go full throttle win mode and finish 8th worst. Now you're at 10% which is pretty non existent. Only about 5 losses usually separate the 4th and 8th seeds, so benching a starter here and there would probably do the trick. Also, while there was no consensus 5th best player last year (and isn't this year so far), one could emerge.
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
Negged.
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
Yep, it might be time for half the team to be quarantined in an Ebola scare. Whatever it takes.
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
Another reason to be serious as a heart attack about tanking RIGHT NOW. Gotta play the odds while we have them.
Jamezz
Well-Known Member
Tanking must be destroyed, make the draft position be determined throughout a 4 year period (the time a rookie contract lasts). Let's see what team has the balls to tank and sell it to their fan base with a straight face. Let's face it, most fans want instant gratification..
Cry me a river and jump in it.
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
How does that fence feel? Might wanna pick a side before it becomes a permanent part of your ***.
Oh boo hoo. I am excited for a Jazz game and think the team will win. How DARE I predict that Jazz will be 8-17 after the next three games?!?!
If it makes you feel better I think they finish the road trip at 2-4 at best. Feel better sweetheart?
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
Ok, I feel better. However, if Utah ****s up their tank this year by going on a win streak, I will be making a trip to Utah for the sole purpose of kicking you in the nuts repeatedly. Let's see you sit on that fence with swollen man-berries.
Sweet. Always did want to know how Hrpring would look in orange.
I haven't been on the fence at all this year. But keep preaching that line. Hope Exum, Hood and Gobert have monster games.
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
Great idea if you want small market teams to be stuck at the bottom forever. We're already screwed when it comes to FAs, and now you want the draft to go against us as well. Utah voted against changing the lottery system for a reason. You should be glad our FO doesn't think the way you do.
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
#WinningStreakIsGood2DraftChristianWood
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Well, my bubble has been burst a bit. I was relying on hoopshype for the cap info and got all excited by looking at just the bottom number for the Jazz ($49.3M).
What I now realize after updating my own spreadsheet is the $49M does not include the QO to Kanter and the team options on Booker and Murry. So the Jazz could only get down to about $54M after cap holds (1st round pick + roster spots up to 12 players). Probably could find a trading partner for Novak if needed, so let's say $51M. But that would include renouncing the rights to Kanter and Booker, too. I see Utah keeping Kanter, so add back the QO. Keep Booker and the Jazz will be around $66M with cap holds. Depending on how much the cap increases, we'll only have a little bit under the cap + the exceptions to go after free agents.
Someone please correct me if my numbers are wrong. GVC?
https://hoopshype.com/salaries/utah.htm
What I now realize after updating my own spreadsheet is the $49M does not include the QO to Kanter and the team options on Booker and Murry. So the Jazz could only get down to about $54M after cap holds (1st round pick + roster spots up to 12 players). Probably could find a trading partner for Novak if needed, so let's say $51M. But that would include renouncing the rights to Kanter and Booker, too. I see Utah keeping Kanter, so add back the QO. Keep Booker and the Jazz will be around $66M with cap holds. Depending on how much the cap increases, we'll only have a little bit under the cap + the exceptions to go after free agents.
Someone please correct me if my numbers are wrong. GVC?
https://hoopshype.com/salaries/utah.htm
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GVC
Well-Known Member
1. Although he hasn't put up Alec's contract yet, shamsports is the site to go for accurate salary information. Hoopshype is sometimes wrong.
2. Without considering minimum roster charges, Gordo, Favs, Exum, Novak, Burks, Burke, Hood and Gobert bring the Jazz up over $49mil. If you pick up Booker's option, and include cap holds for Enes and a top 5 pick, you can add about $20mil to that number.
3. The most recent reports I've read (it's been a while) had the owners not in favor of smoothing the increase in the cap, so if the Jazz want to keep Booker and Kanter, they effectively won't have any cap space next summer.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Thanks, GVC for confirming the numbers. We essentially have the same conclusions.
Guess the only thing to do if the Jazz have a FA they really want is to not pick up the option on Booker and trade Novak. They could sign the FA and then use the MLE to re-sign Booker if they still need him as a backup PF, right? Booker might sign elsewhere, but that wouldn't be a disaster. If Gobert's minutes increase next season, it has to come at the expense of the backup PF (providing Kanter is still on the roster).
If the Jazz get a big in the draft, either Booker or Kanter would be expendable. And if they get a wing, I can't see them going after another in free agency, as they already have Hayward, Burks and Hood. I think Rodney is a definite rotation player. So Jazz just need to replace the minutes Ingles is getting with a player who can shoot.
Guess the only thing to do if the Jazz have a FA they really want is to not pick up the option on Booker and trade Novak. They could sign the FA and then use the MLE to re-sign Booker if they still need him as a backup PF, right? Booker might sign elsewhere, but that wouldn't be a disaster. If Gobert's minutes increase next season, it has to come at the expense of the backup PF (providing Kanter is still on the roster).
If the Jazz get a big in the draft, either Booker or Kanter would be expendable. And if they get a wing, I can't see them going after another in free agency, as they already have Hayward, Burks and Hood. I think Rodney is a definite rotation player. So Jazz just need to replace the minutes Ingles is getting with a player who can shoot.
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Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
GVC, a couple more ?'s to ask since you are the CBA guru.
Let's suppose the Jazz do trade Novak, don't pick up the option on Booker, but give a QO to Kanter. Let's just say that opens up $8M in cap space. They use up that cap space on a free agent. Now it's time to go back and negotiate a contract with Kanter. I know they can match any offer and go over the cap in doing so, provided the FA is signed BEFORE they match an offer for Enes. I know the timing is critical on that, as we saw with the Bosh/Parsons situation in Houston. Bosh would have needed to sign first. If Kanter doesn't get an offer from another team, Utah can exceed the cap to re-sign him to any amount (well, up to a max contract), correct?
Also, as I was reading through Coon's FAQ, it appears teams under the cap have less of an MLE to use. So if Utah were to get under the cap by the moves above, would they then lose the higher MLE and not be able to re-sign Booker at the $5M price (or whatever that MLE is) and just have the lower MLE left to use?
Let's suppose the Jazz do trade Novak, don't pick up the option on Booker, but give a QO to Kanter. Let's just say that opens up $8M in cap space. They use up that cap space on a free agent. Now it's time to go back and negotiate a contract with Kanter. I know they can match any offer and go over the cap in doing so, provided the FA is signed BEFORE they match an offer for Enes. I know the timing is critical on that, as we saw with the Bosh/Parsons situation in Houston. Bosh would have needed to sign first. If Kanter doesn't get an offer from another team, Utah can exceed the cap to re-sign him to any amount (well, up to a max contract), correct?
Also, as I was reading through Coon's FAQ, it appears teams under the cap have less of an MLE to use. So if Utah were to get under the cap by the moves above, would they then lose the higher MLE and not be able to re-sign Booker at the $5M price (or whatever that MLE is) and just have the lower MLE left to use?