Why can't people who leave the LDS church move on?

[Nate505]

My point was a parent can cut off a kid for whatever reason they want and should not be judged for it. Some parents stop helping kids financially after 18 anyways. It's the parents money and its their choice to help their adult child financially however they see fit.....or not at all.

Of course they should be judged. It's one thing for a parent to not help an adult child financially based on principle (though I don't understand it, but whatever), but it's another to use it as a bribe for a child to make a spiritual decision.

It's also bizarre for a parent to get someone to follow their religion on a quid pro quo basis.

 

[Sneakers]

Wonder if you could sue for the money left to you by your uncle.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

I'm, for all intents and purposes, an ex-mormon, but I've never been antagonistic to the church publicly or privately. I don't have any ill-will towards the church in anyway, I just don't believe anything about it. I suppose you could say that it's just not for me.

I went on a full two year mission to South Korea, and many from my mission (a significant number) are currently inactive and none of them went off the deep end. I know two people from high school who are angry at the Mormon church. One got the **** beat out of him in eastern europe like three times and the other is a militant lesbian who works at a bar.

This is all anecdotal but it's a counterpoint to Beanclown's experience. The majority of my friends who are not currently active(maybe 20) are not, in any way shape or form, angry or obsessed at or with the LDS church. The reason you hear about it is simply because the ones who are angry, are also loud. I'm not loud about my disbelief, who cares? It's not a big deal. You wouldn't know about any of these types of people because WTF would they tell you about it or post about it on facebook (lifeinvader)? They really don't care.

thank you for reading

~Safetydan

Excellent post and I completely agree. This matches my experience as well. I left the church and have lots of friends who also left the church. None of us spend any energy or effort telling anybody else that they ought to leave the church and we don't appreciate it when people try to drag us into the church. There are a lot of things I admire about the Mormon church, especially the focus on family, but one thing that I do not admire at all is the holier than thou attitude and the belief that they are right and everyone else is wrong. This, in a nutshell, is why I love to see BYU lose. Cheering against that team, though, is really the extent of my anti-Mormonism. That's why I take issue with bean's assertion that all ex-Mormons are consumed with their anger toward the church. It's simply not true. Not even close.

 

[Stoked]

Of course they should be judged. It's one thing for a parent to not help an adult child financially based on principle (though I don't understand it, but whatever), but it's another to use it as a bribe for a child to make a spiritual decision.

It's also bizarre for a parent to get someone to follow their religion on a quid pro quo basis.

It happens way to much. Us former missionaries all know other former missionaries that were only there due to some financial gain from their parents. Had one guy that would get a brand new Shelby GT if he went on a mission.

As for my kids...as long as they are happy, well rounded, good to the important people in their life and not actively breaking laws I have succeeded. Rich, poor, straight, non religious, liberal, conservative...all that is up to them.

 

[Safetydan]

Excellent post and I completely agree. This matches my experience as well. I left the church and have lots of friends who also left the church. None of us spend any energy or effort telling anybody else that they ought to leave the church and we don't appreciate it when people try to drag us into the church. There are a lot of things I admire about the Mormon church, especially the focus on family, but one thing that I do not admire at all is the holier than thou attitude and the belief that they are right and everyone else is wrong. This, in a nutshell, is why I love to see BYU lose. Cheering against that team, though, is really the extent of my anti-Mormonism. That's why I take issue with bean's assertion that all ex-Mormons are consumed with their anger toward the church. It's simply not true. Not even close.

Ha, I'm a BYU fan. I don't see the BYU football team as a representative of the church though, even if they do themselves. That probably doesn't make sense but whatever.

When it comes to holier than thou attitudes, every religion and, especially, culture seems to have that. The religious faux-superiority from mormons and other denominations doesn't bother me as much as ethnocentrism, although they are close. I could elaborate but I don't like to type for long periods of time. I'll just say that living here in South Korea gives me another perspective on a lot of things. These are things I couldn't see or experience whilst living within a mission bubble.

 

[moevillini]

perhaps you won't consider this to be in the same category, but it sort of reminds me of some of those who have quit smoking who become the biggest anti-smoking zealots or those who had an abortion (or a guy who contributed to a pregnancy and consented that it be terminated) who become the biggest anti-choice zealots. I don't know if it's in part to atone for something they did that they now consider to be a huge sin or what, but they can become extremely outspoken opponents of something that they once participated in.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Was it the religion that influenced your parents to be like that? Or would your parents be overbearing regardless of religion?

I know that a certain doctrine called "free agency" was ignored by your parents. As was the whole concept of "charity." When looking at the family proclamation and other church teachings, raising a family can be interpreted in varying techniques and methods. However, that whole forcing, over-extension, and taking away stuff that wasn't theirs to take away, is sort of the opposite of what the church teaches.

I wonder if your parents would find excuses in other christian denominations, Islamic groups, and eastern religions to rationalize their actions? This is more on your parents than on the church. If you were Muslim then chances are they would have taken away all that stuff to force you on a pilgrimage to Mecca.

And to be honest, I've never understood why parents use forms of bribery or punishment to force their kids on missions. Perhaps it's because of societal pressures? Or because parents can be jerks and way overbearing? But anyone that has actually been on a mission can tell you that the good to best missionaries are the ones that want to be there. Those who suck, are those who are merely there because of their family, friends, or want to get married easier.

IMO, people use the church to rationalize their overbearing and offensive words and deeds. While many blame the church for failed relationships which would have failed anyway regardless of religion. It's impossible to know for sure, but if it hadn't been your mission it probably would have been something else which would have driven a wedge between you folks. Heck, other issues were probably already boiling over when all of this went down anyway.

While everything you say here may be true, I could give you at least a dozen examples from my own circle of friends where they same thing happened. Most are not quite this extreme, but one of them is far more extreme. My personal experience was more along the lines of Safety Dan. My parents were secure in who they are and when I decided not to go on a mission they recognized that was my choice to make. My grandparents did not feel at all the same way, and neither did a number of other extended family members. Some of them have made concerted efforts to bring me back into the church. I've told them I have no interest. Some of them understand. Others apparently think I have difficulty understanding English and think they might get a different answer if they phrase their unsolicited advice/questions in a different way.

Now that I think this through I'm wondering if bean's impression of this topic might have more to do with his desire to bring these people back than with their desire to move away. Maybe bean is actually the one who is turning every conversation to the topic of religion, and maybe he feels this hatred for the church simply because he's uncomfortable hearing these people's honest answers to his efforts. I know that if he pressed the topic with me he probably wouldn't enjoy hearing the real reasons that I left the church and will never return. I won't deny that there are people who are very aggressive in their hatred for the church, but I think it's a massive overstatement to say that everyone who leaves becomes obsessed about it in a negative way.

BTW, I agree with PKM that this has been an excellent discussion. Until recently I hadn't really ventured into the General Discussion forum, but I've been glad I did. Lots of well thought out and thought provoking comments.

 

[Beantown]

Of course they should be judged. It's one thing for a parent to not help an adult child financially based on principle (though I don't understand it, but whatever), but it's another to use it as a bribe for a child to make a spiritual decision.

It's also bizarre for a parent to get someone to follow their religion on a quid pro quo basis.

My parents didn't pay anything for me after high school. I learned to work and pay for my own things. I didn't need them. Why is it so hard for college kids to pay for a phone, car and rent during college? My car was paid for, my cell phone was like 30 bucks a month and my rent was $250.........how lazy are people?

 

[Stoked]

My parents didn't pay anything for me after high school. I learned to work and pay for my own things. I didn't need them. Why is it so hard for college kids to pay for a phone, car and rent during college? My car was paid for, my cell phone was like 30 bucks a month and my rent was $250.........how lazy are people?

Not all situations are exactly the same.

 

[Beantown]

Did you even read his post? The money they withheld was not their money. It was money given to pickled by a wealthy uncle. His parents stole that money because he decided not to be Mormon.

Did you even read his post?....He was referring also to his parents not paying for his car and his phone

Also if this money was setup in his name his parents wouldn't be able to touch it since he was an adult......so that part makes no sense.

Also many many many people leave money for only certain purposes. Like my friend got money from his great grandpa who passed but it was only set aside for him to use to pay for the mission....that was it.

My point in all this is as adult you should not expect money from ANYONE....even your parents. And if you do accept money as an adult you must know with that money comes with strings attached to it. Its their money and you can choose to accept those attachments or not.

 

[Archie Moses]

Awww Beantown,Beantown.... You are the exact reason I thought twice before wanting to share my experiences. My parents were INHIBITING me from STILL attending college. I wasn't dropping out, I was doing everything a responsible young male should be doing at that age. If you have the ability to help your children get through college and they are doing what they should be doing, wouldn't you help them out? Or would you rather potentially turn them into a poverty ridden teenager for not wanting to advertise your beliefs somewhere for two years? I don't understand your reasoning and you seem like the type of person that I will never understand, so I will probably not waste my time past this post with you....hopefully.

My parents never gave me a damn dime to attend college. I worked two jobs, saved money, applied for grants and scholarships and graduated debt free. Why do people feel so entitled to have their parents hold their hands?

With that said, your parents shouldn't have pulled the church card on you. That's pretty lame.

 

[Archie Moses]

Of course they should be judged. It's one thing for a parent to not help an adult child financially based on principle (though I don't understand it, but whatever), but it's another to use it as a bribe for a child to make a spiritual decision.

It's also bizarre for a parent to get someone to follow their religion on a quid pro quo basis.

Spot on. Repped.