da ThRONe
Active Member
No but what you say should have some merit to it. I didn't dispute the other critiques of Burke because they are IMO legit concerns. I just pointed out the ones that you listed that seems illogical.
why so many of you giving up on Burke? He is our future PG, period!
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No but what you say should have some merit to it. I didn't dispute the other critiques of Burke because they are IMO legit concerns. I just pointed out the ones that you listed that seems illogical.
Sexual Favors
Well-Known Member
This is ludicrous. He shot poorly in Summer League before his injury. It was his lack of size, pace, and athleticism at the pro level that had him line driving shots well before his finger injury. Can P3 make him a better athlete? Better hope so. Ever since summer league, his jumper has been releasing flat, unlike his FT's, and that's because a jumper requires one to jump, and the kid couldn't, because he was tired, because he is a poor athlete, at this point.
And saying "he slowed down the offense so Hayward could be the primary ball handler in the half court" is really looking through the blinders. Hayward wanted to run. Trey said he played slow, because he wasn't comfortable playing fast, on locker clean out day.
da ThRONe
Active Member
So your saying you believe that based on a poor shooting performance from summer league that him breaking his finger had no impact whatsoever during the regular season?
Also I would like a link to this supposed quote from Burke. So I can hear/read what he said myself. I have a hard time buying he would struggle with probably the easiest part of basketball especially when he thrived in these situation in college.
Doublea
Well-Known Member
I agree that he really needs to get stronger though. But I don't think you give enough credit to him. He'll get better, just like he did in college.
Sexual Favors
Well-Known Member
To your first point, no, I am not saying that. I am saying you can't claim that is the only reason though, when there were signs beforehand that his jumper was out of form. He said many times during summer league, and the season, that he was exhausted. A lot of rookies get tired, particularly those who don't have a size or athletic advantage. He also said that it was his legs affecting his shot many times. He should be a bit better next season.
As for pace. Believe it. College is a 35 second shot clock. That's a whole 11 seconds more he had to work with. The specific interview where he said the pace was his fault, is the David Locke interview from locker clean out, I believe. https://1280thezone.com/index.php/audio/listen/utah_jazz_locker_clean_out_trey_burke. Unfortunately, 1280 has been having server errors, so the audio doesn't load anymore. I am, however, not the only person have heard him say it. Many people on this forum have referenced it, and Locke has discussed it a couple of times in his Tip-off.
Sexual Favors
Well-Known Member
I agree that he really needs to get stronger though. But I don't think you give enough credit to him. He'll get better, just like he did in college.
I give plenty of credit, I think. But, I am not going to agree with posters who say his shooting woes started when he broke his finger, or that Trey played slow for Hayward, when Hayward's game is specifically designed for a faster pace.
That's a cool pic of Trey, and yes, he is jumping high off the ground. But, do you not notice how far below the rim his head still is? He is athletic, just like most NBA players are, but he's not athletic enough to compensate for his size. Maybe P3 will transform him, but given his starting point, it isn't likely. Trey could be decent, but if you have the chance to upgrade, you don't not take it because you have Trey Burke.
billyshelby
Well-Known Member
Burke can't drive. Doesn't mean he doesn't have a future as a Billups/Miller type, but he's hardly a shooter at this point. That's his upper trajecory though.
The problem with Burke that I worry about is he likes to call his own number and seems to have an inflated opinion of his offensive worth. In that respect, he's a lot like Mo -- small guard with a Napoleon complex who is fixated on one number in the box score.
But he had a lot to prove, it's only year one, and he might readjust. The other problem, however, is I didn't particularly find his PnR skills to be very impressive. In his rookie year, the PnR was merely a P so he could get a jump shot from mid range that he often missed.
Personally, I'm not that hopeful. But the jury is definitely out.
The problem with Burke that I worry about is he likes to call his own number and seems to have an inflated opinion of his offensive worth. In that respect, he's a lot like Mo -- small guard with a Napoleon complex who is fixated on one number in the box score.
But he had a lot to prove, it's only year one, and he might readjust. The other problem, however, is I didn't particularly find his PnR skills to be very impressive. In his rookie year, the PnR was merely a P so he could get a jump shot from mid range that he often missed.
Personally, I'm not that hopeful. But the jury is definitely out.
(Im from Australia)
Everyone who I talk basketball with goes through the following motions when I tell them I go for the Jazz:
1. Screw up there face thinking wtf
2. Tell me they go for Miami, LAC, LAL, OKC or Bulls.
3. (only applies if they actual watch basketball): Tell me that 'Trey Burke is pretty good'
So I dunno, maybe he is pretty good hahah. I'm still unsold tbh.
Everyone who I talk basketball with goes through the following motions when I tell them I go for the Jazz:
1. Screw up there face thinking wtf
2. Tell me they go for Miami, LAC, LAL, OKC or Bulls.
3. (only applies if they actual watch basketball): Tell me that 'Trey Burke is pretty good'
So I dunno, maybe he is pretty good hahah. I'm still unsold tbh.
I really doubt that jumping ability should be a prime metric for judging PGs. Obvious counter examples are Stockton and Nash, for starters.
da ThRONe
Active Member
Let's try to look at this logically. Trey shots pretty well his Freshman and better his Sophomore years in college. He shots the ball poorly in 3 or 4 Summer league games. He breaks his finger in preseason then shoots a poor percentage during the regular season. Those are the "facts". Again looking at this logical. What's more likely that his legs were tired in SL as he explained and those 3 or 4 poor shooting games were merely a slump. Or that shooting a decent % in college for two years was a fluke and he was likely to shoot poorly regardless of the injury? Since you are saying that the broken finger was only a factor. What % would you say a broken index finger on the shooting hand would have on a players shooting?
1st what do you mean by "pace"? Are we talking about pushing the ball in transition or getting the team into their offensive sets or both?
For the sake of agrument lets assume Trey was indeed the problem and we use both definitions for pace. We are still talking about a rookie PG. Wouldn't these be the things you expect a young PG to struggle with? People here literally found fault in his great assist to turnover ratio saying turnovers was the easist things to fix. How difficult is it for Trey to adjust the pace? That logically is easier to fix than learning to take care of the ball.
Again if we are talking about getting his team into an offensive set earlier this really makes no sense. Hayward was the primary ball handler in the half court the majority of the season. So what was Burke suppose to do pass the ball to Hayward sooner? It was bad coaching on Corbin part to have Burke bring the ball pass the time line only for him to give it to Hayward. If Gordon is who Ty wanted running the show he should have just let him bring the ball up court. Again blaming Burke for the pace makes no sense to me having watch the majority of the Jazz' games.
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da ThRONe
Active Member
As a NOLA sports fan it's funny I remember people telling me Chris Paul couldn't drive.
I'd agree there were times where Burke should have passed the ball. However he was used as the 2 guard the majority of the time and that's how Burke played like the SG for the Jazz.
Of course he has a lot to "prove" and his game has a ton of room for improvement. Not sure how you didn't come away impressed with his PNR game though. Unless you were upset that the team didn't use it more. Again he did lead the team in APG's as a secondary playmaker. He couldn't have shot the ball every time down.
jazzrule
Well-Known Member
To me this is just AKMVP trying to stop Exum from being drafted by the Jazz. I am not down on Aaron Gordon as much as AKMVP is on Exum. How can any of us know for sure Exum will be a bust like AKMVP seems to know? Well at least AKMVP approached it from a different angle than all his other anti-Exum post.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
With the offense that we ran last year, could even S2M avg double figures?
You remember our offense with the standing around stuff?
Now
Compare that to the Spurs offense of great spacing, cutting, high/low big men passing (Diaw to Duncan/splitter) and you know high percentage in rhythm shooting.
With Corbin the spurs are a lotto team
With pops, I bet he gets this dumpster fire into that 10-7 range and possibly making the playoffs.
You remember our offense with the standing around stuff?
Now
Compare that to the Spurs offense of great spacing, cutting, high/low big men passing (Diaw to Duncan/splitter) and you know high percentage in rhythm shooting.
With Corbin the spurs are a lotto team
With pops, I bet he gets this dumpster fire into that 10-7 range and possibly making the playoffs.
Burke is a Keeper.. His stats as a rookie are comparable to Tony Parker's,. Physically his similar to Parker. If he will become like Parker Can't be discerned from his rookie year and from last year's situation (Corbin, Hayfence, etc.). I am convinced that his Skill set and mentality are there for him to be at least a good player.. How he shows next year will indicate if he has the Will to be great.
Below is a link to TB3 and Parker comp.. I cant compare Rookie years though...
https://stats.nba.com/playerVsPlayer.html?PlayerID=2225&VsPlayerID=203504
Below is a link to TB3 and Parker comp.. I cant compare Rookie years though...
https://stats.nba.com/playerVsPlayer.html?PlayerID=2225&VsPlayerID=203504
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
How is he physically compared to Parker? Parker has like 4 inches on him
Where are you getting that from? Trey Burke is 6'1". Tony Parker is 6'2"
https://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/2579260/trey-burke
https://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/1015/tony-parker
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
I always figured TP was 6'3-4"
But how do they compare with speed and quickness?
Im not on the abandon Burke at all costs ship. But I don't see any comparisons to TP. TP might be the quickest PG in the game besides westbrooke.
da ThRONe
Active Member
Straight line speed Burke is probably in the top 25% of all point guards quickness he's probably somewhere in the middle. I would say Tony's in his prime was top 15% in both categories.
Again as someone who followed Chris Paul's career @WF then had "my team" draft him I see Burke comparing to Paul more than any other guard. Similar athletes, similar skill sets, PNR dominate, similar BBIQ, and similar size. Paul was more pass 1st especially early in games. I think Burke has the luxury of sitting down with Stockton and they are going to go over film and John will point out to Trey all the times passing was a better option. I think Trey based on Snyder forte' being PNR and based on his own hard work will have a huge jump in production like he did from year 1 to year 2 @UofM.