gregbroncs
Well-Known Member
Yea I hope this was meant as hyperbole because Millsap is not a top 10 PF.
Jazz Offer Millsap Extension
- Thread starter nightmare3983
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Greg Miller has also given KOC the green light to spend money at will, so it isn't really fair to call him cheap.
Name 10 who are better.
Aldridge
Bosh
Griffin
Love
Dirk
Gasol
Josh Smith (maybe)
Kevin Garnett (maybe)
Then who?
No defense or rebounding Amare? No defense Randolph (srsly overrated because of 1 good playoff series)?
Bosh
Griffin
Love
Dirk
Gasol
Josh Smith (maybe)
Kevin Garnett (maybe)
Then who?
No defense or rebounding Amare? No defense Randolph (srsly overrated because of 1 good playoff series)?
Alright guys... here's how it is with me.
Any more than 12m a year, and we should take an offer off the table.
10m a year is negotiable, as long as some of that 10m is through bonus', like making the all-star game, playing 76+ games, all making the all NBA team, etc.
Any more than 12m a year, and we should take an offer off the table.
10m a year is negotiable, as long as some of that 10m is through bonus', like making the all-star game, playing 76+ games, all making the all NBA team, etc.
Negged for quality of post.
Also, I'm not going to put Cousins in the conversation because his stats have not translated to winning at all and are probably out of proportion, along with the lack of defensive effort. Anthony Davis is a rookie, any ranking of him is purely speculative at this point and based on future potential, not current ability.
West is the old version of Millsap, he is on the decline. Lee plays no defense. Boozer plays no defense. Odom didn't even play last year. Nene is a center. Gibson, Ilyasova, and Humphries aren't nearly as good as Millsap.
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Yeah, giving him bonuses that will be impossible to meet because of his role/playing time is really fair. A bonus for 6th man of the year or exceptional per minute averages would make more sense.
underKANTER
Well-Known Member
in no specific order:
top tier:
gasol, duncan, garnett, nowitzki, griffin, love
second tier:
aldridge, smith, bosh, randolph, stoudemire
third tier:
nene, odom, lee, monroe and cousins (if considered pf's), millsap, boozer, west
fourth tier:
ibaka, ilyasova, humphries, gibson, davis (has to prove something yet)
to be fair: millsap is a top 15-20 pf, never ever top 10.
top tier:
gasol, duncan, garnett, nowitzki, griffin, love
second tier:
aldridge, smith, bosh, randolph, stoudemire
third tier:
nene, odom, lee, monroe and cousins (if considered pf's), millsap, boozer, west
fourth tier:
ibaka, ilyasova, humphries, gibson, davis (has to prove something yet)
to be fair: millsap is a top 15-20 pf, never ever top 10.
green
Well-Known Member
The more moves the Jazz make, the more clear it becomes that they are building around Jefferson/Favors. The did this, then leaked it, to let us know they tried and let other teams know Millsap is available.
It is sad, I'll miss him, but to pay him more than they offered is suicide. I have lived through Ostertag and AK. Don't add Millsap to that list. Trade him (although I wish it was Al over Millsap).
It is sad, I'll miss him, but to pay him more than they offered is suicide. I have lived through Ostertag and AK. Don't add Millsap to that list. Trade him (although I wish it was Al over Millsap).
Are you giving life time achievement awards out to Duncan and Garnett?
underKANTER
Well-Known Member
a little bit maybe... but they still can incredibly impact a game with their effort on the defensive end... they are still one of the better defensive bigs and still can play great in the playoffs... second tier might be fair and more appropriate...
underKANTER
Well-Known Member
millsap is a very good player. a fan favourite. a warrior. he even tries on the defensive end. but he struggles against many bigger and more athletic/quicker players in the nba (mostly on the defensive side of the floor). he is an average athlete that is undersized. while he is good on the offensive end, he is average on the defensive end at best because of his shortcomings i mentioned above.
come on. odom has put all-star numbers for the lakers and has been consistently a great versatile all-around player for many years. i know, he refused to play for dallas and sucked big time over there but he'll be good for the clips again.
ibaka has improved his jumpshot and is an elite level shot blocker and can alter shots but he is a little bit overrated as a defender and is a decent rebounder but not great. his offense with decent free throw shooting ability have still some room to improve. should be in the third tier by next year but rather not right now. should be a 10/10/4 force if he plays 30+ minutes. but if he can't fix his fouling numbers, he will rather be a 8-8-3/4 type of a player.
theNBAnerd
Well-Known Member
that's interesting i didn't realize until now that the new CBA has a max veteran extension salary that is different from max salary, but there it is: 107.5% of previous salary as a max first year, then 7.5% raises from that amount.
knowing that, i think there's a reason the news was worded the way it was. i think both camps wanted fans to know that the conversation started, even though realistically there was never any chance he would take 3/25M. paul and his agent had to know that was the max offer, so this meeting was probably a formality. jazz probably sat down and said something like, "hey the most we can offer is 3 and 25M, but we didnt' want to NOT make you the offer, so there it is." paul probably said "i understand, thanks for officially starting negotiations, but i think you'll understand why i'll wait until i can get more than that from you. talk to you next summer?" jazz: "makes sense. we hope we can keep you around, and we'll talk next july."
knowing that, i think there's a reason the news was worded the way it was. i think both camps wanted fans to know that the conversation started, even though realistically there was never any chance he would take 3/25M. paul and his agent had to know that was the max offer, so this meeting was probably a formality. jazz probably sat down and said something like, "hey the most we can offer is 3 and 25M, but we didnt' want to NOT make you the offer, so there it is." paul probably said "i understand, thanks for officially starting negotiations, but i think you'll understand why i'll wait until i can get more than that from you. talk to you next summer?" jazz: "makes sense. we hope we can keep you around, and we'll talk next july."
Chargers Jazz Angels
Well-Known Member
Interesting if the jazz decide to trade him what team needs a pf that could give use some talent in return?
I guess you didn't understand the Jazz offered him the MAX they can with the new CBA. How is that low-balling a player?
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Have to admit I was unaware they could only offer him slightly more than $8M under the new CBA. Of course he's going to turn it down - and I don't blame him. But there's a paragraph in the article that backs up what I have been saying all along.
"In a proactive effort that represents the Jazz's desire to keep Millsap but retain future financial flexibility, the Jazz have already begun examining which teams could afford to pay Millsap the $10 million to $14 million average salary he's expected to seek if he becomes a free agent."
If he seeks $14M and the Jazz offer $10M, the most likely scenario, if he really wants to remain in Utah, is to split the difference. But if he only cares about the money, he just might be able to get $13M or $14M based on what some of the other FA forwards received this summer.
theNBAnerd
Well-Known Member
cowhide is right everybody -- the max salary (30% of cap) doesn't apply to paul because the new CBA has different rules for a veteran extension that limit the first year salary to whichever is SMALLER between that player's max and 107.5% of his previous salary.
https://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q58
https://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q58
Chargers Jazz Angels
Well-Known Member
Perfect team would be Philly either a package for iggy or millsap for Thad young.
Cleveland for say Tristan Thompson or verajao.
Detroit as a mentor for Drummond.
Indy but they really don't have anything I would want that they would give up.
Charlotte needs him but they have nothing we want.
Orlando but won't do anything until d12 is traded.
Houston apparently wanted him.
Phoenix needs him but they just invested in Beasley
Sactown also millsap for Jimmer (sarcasm)
Cleveland for say Tristan Thompson or verajao.
Detroit as a mentor for Drummond.
Indy but they really don't have anything I would want that they would give up.
Charlotte needs him but they have nothing we want.
Orlando but won't do anything until d12 is traded.
Houston apparently wanted him.
Phoenix needs him but they just invested in Beasley
Sactown also millsap for Jimmer (sarcasm)
theNBAnerd
Well-Known Member
that paragraph doesn't mean what you're making it mean. it doesn't mean they're preparing to lose him... it means they're figuring out if there really is a market for him to make 10M, or 14M, or something less, or something more. it's not that hard to project how many teams will have cap space next summer, then you look at what other free agents are out there and it's pretty easy to determine whether the jazz will be negotiating with millsap in a buyer's market or a seller's market. and just because other forwards got 10-12M this summer doesn't mean anything for next summer, depending on who has money to spend and what they want to spend it on.
also, remember that next season is when the punitive luxury tax elements hit, too. there might not be a long list of buyers.
so i took that paragraph to just mean that they're doing their homework on who might be paul's suitors and whether they're likely to pay in that range.