ENES KANTER: The third and last game of the preparation tourney will start in half an hour

[prodigy]

1a) Paul Millsap - continued improvement of his offensive game get's him this spot, pretty reliable, only his size limits him defensively
1b) Al Jefferson - Big Al is one of the best offensive big men in the NBA and can get better defensively
3) Derrick Favors - the guys potential is ridiculous, just needs the minutes I think will go down as one of the best jazz players ever
4) Devin Harris - I thought he played pretty well considering the situation he was in, when he got injured it killed us(lost 7 of 8 games he missed) so his importance can't be overstated.
5) Gordon Hayward(AK is here if he comes back) - Loved how he finished the year, really showed off his great all-around ablity

 

[Deleted member 848]

1a) Paul Millsap - continued improvement of his offensive game get's him this spot, pretty reliable, only his size limits him defensively
1b) Al Jefferson - Big Al is one of the best offensive big men in the NBA and can get better defensively
3) Derrick Favors - the guys potential is ridiculous, just needs the minutes I think will go down as one of the best jazz players ever
4) Devin Harris - I thought he played pretty well considering the situation he was in, when he got injured it killed us(lost 7 of 8 games he missed) so his importance can't be overstated.
5) Gordon Hayward(AK is here if he comes back) - Loved how he finished the year, really showed off his great all-around ablity

iawtp. Would rep If I hadn't recently.

 

[InGameStrategy]

Whatever i say , you will find a suitable way to manipulate my answers and say it is irrelevant, but if KOC has shared your opinion, he wouldnt probably have drafted Kanter.

Sorry, bro (I'm presuming you're a bro); manipulation is not my intention. It's just that when you implied (or when I inferred) that AJ's "commitment" to Utah (or outlook) has been affected somehow by the drafting of a still-untested Kanter (whom Big Al might not know much about, much less fear losing his spot as a pivotal player and potential cornerstone on the team), my irrelevantometer and homerometer simultaneously sounded.

So at this point, AJ should create miracles in order to prove he is a good asset for this team in long term. (Considering the possible heavy salaries Hayward, Favors and maybe even Kanter and Burks will get in a few years, it doesnt seem possible)

I think that your use of "miracles" here is overstating the point. While the Boozer experiment might suggest that a defense-less player starting to defend is a small miracle, both CB and AJ proved that they could play defense (at least every once in a blue moon--or contract year). They just have to start focusing on it--or the coaches have to start benching them when they don't. Tom Thibodeau (who, btw, has been available for hire for the past few years) already has started (although the motivation might have been offense, not defense).
https://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/nba/news/story?id=5993919

Or both.

In their cases, defense has more to do with discipline than with IQ.

 

[Deleted member 848]

Do you believe anything just because it's said? Last year, Al supposedly worked really hard, but how do you quantify that, and does that ultimately matter? He came into camp slow and ended the season slow.

Naw, I just see improvements in his play from every statisctical category over last year, and he had to work extra hard seeing as it was his second season back from ACL reconstruction. If you didnt see the improvement in Al's play over the course of last season on both Ends of the floor then youre either visually impaired, or heabily biased to the extent where you refuse to seek any positive light in Al Jeffersons development in his tenure at Utah.

PS, Id say he ended the season quite well, being one of the greatest scorers and rebounders in the NBA after the All-Star Break, during the playoff push when he lead the team. Also, his interior passing and defense improved, although the latter was somewhat marginal

 

[Dr. Jones]

1a) Paul Millsap - continued improvement of his offensive game get's him this spot, pretty reliable, only his size limits him defensively
1b) Al Jefferson - Big Al is one of the best offensive big men in the NBA and can get better defensively
3) Derrick Favors - the guys potential is ridiculous, just needs the minutes I think will go down as one of the best jazz players ever
4) Devin Harris - I thought he played pretty well considering the situation he was in, when he got injured it killed us(lost 7 of 8 games he missed) so his importance can't be overstated.
5) Gordon Hayward(AK is here if he comes back) - Loved how he finished the year, really showed off his great all-around ablity

Good list.

 

[Jazz4ever]

Here is the list of the top players last year in regards to adj +/-
People really don't have a clue how good Sap has become. He is the kind of guy you don't appreciate until after you trade him, and wonder why you have became the next Clippers, winning 20 games year in and year out.

1. Chris Paul +18.54
2. Steve Nash +14.41
3. Dwight Howard + 14.06
4. Larmarcus Aldridge +13.79
5. Kevin Garnett +12.85
6. Dirk Nowitzki +12.52
7. Pau Gasol +11.85
8. Derrick Rose +11.66
9. Manu Ginobili + 11.61
10. Paul Millsap +11.56

 

[Zerol]

Okay, I don't see LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Blake Griffin, Durant on this list. Does it mean Millsap is better than these guys??

Here is the list of the top players last year in regards to adj +/-
People really don't have a clue how good Sap has become. He is the kind of guy you don't appreciate until after you trade him, and wonder why you have became the next Clippers, winning 20 games year in and year out.

1. Chris Paul +18.54
2. Steve Nash +14.41
3. Dwight Howard + 14.06
4. Larmarcus Aldridge +13.79
5. Kevin Garnett +12.85
6. Dirk Nowitzki +12.52
7. Pau Gasol +11.85
8. Derrick Rose +11.66
9. Manu Ginobili + 11.61
10. Paul Millsap +11.56

 

[NUMBERICA]

Okay, I don't see LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Blake Griffin, Durant on this list. Does it mean Millsap is better than these guys??

It's an indicator. I know this is hard, but it's a pretty good indicator that says "Millsap is pretty damn good".

I feel like I'm interrupting someone bringing to light that Millsap is just 2 short (and having nothing else to say). So I yield the floor for this inevitable point that hasn't yet been brought up.

 

[margodydek]

Here is the list of the top players last year in regards to adj +/-
People really don't have a clue how good Sap has become. He is the kind of guy you don't appreciate until after you trade him, and wonder why you have became the next Clippers, winning 20 games year in and year out.

1. Chris Paul +18.54
2. Steve Nash +14.41
3. Dwight Howard + 14.06
4. Larmarcus Aldridge +13.79
5. Kevin Garnett +12.85
6. Dirk Nowitzki +12.52
7. Pau Gasol +11.85
8. Derrick Rose +11.66
9. Manu Ginobili + 11.61
10. Paul Millsap +11.56

Paul's great, but I don't feel like losing him would put the franchise in a tailspin that we wouldn't recover from by 2020. And if we did trade him and wound up winning 20 games a year for a number of years, then I'm afraid if we had kept him we'd only have won maybe 23 games a year for a number of years.

 

[Deleted member 848]

It's an indicator. I know this is hard, but it's a pretty good indicator that says "Millsap is pretty damn good".

I feel like I'm interrupting someone bringing to light that Millsap is just 2 short (and having nothing else to say). So I yield the floor for this inevitable point that hasn't yet been brought up.

I've honestly never understood the "too-short" allegations. I mean come on, some of the alltime best power forwards are considered "short" by todays standards. Dennis Rodman was 6'6", Charles Barkley was anwhere from 6'4" to 6'6" and theyre both considered one fo the best at their respective positions, especially rodman in terms of defense. Height is a barrier, but there are obvious ways of working around it. Sure, Sap got obliterated by LaMarcus Aldridge and the likes, so?? Work on speed. And im sure he knows this. If theres anyone who can work around a born-deficiency, its Sap. If he devoted as much time on defense as he normally does on expanding his offensive games, Millsap would be more than just a fringe-allstar. And the poster who said Millsap isnt clutch clearly missed the Houston and the Miami games this season.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Rule changes probably have some effect. Rodman played in an era when you could be more physical against guys.

 

[JFFR]

Millsap comes back better every year.

He will be better next year. Don't trade him! Kanter is gonna suck as a rookie!

 

[NUMBERICA]

Rule changes probably have some effect. Rodman played in an era when you could be more physical against guys.

Whether the game is called differently or not (which would be quite difficult to substantiate one way or another with real facts), I don't believe there have been any rule changes for the physicality of interior play. There was the hand-checking rule being disallowed on the perimeter and zone allowed, but I'm pretty sure that's about it since Rodman played.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Millsap is either going to become rich man's Harpring (better spot-up shooter, better passer, better defender but not as good at being dirty/flopping/getting under other players' skin), or he's going to go to the Kevin Love school and learn to spread the floor while bringing his rebound numbers up by learning to use his body and angles better (as his greatest skill in rebounding has previously been instinct and tenacity and he could make some major strides in rebounding fundamentals).

That's my hope anyway. He can really only be one or the other, though.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Millsap is either going to become rich man's Harpring (better spot-up shooter, better passer, better defender but not as good at being dirty/flopping/getting under other players' skin), or he's going to go to the Kevin Love school and learn to spread the floor while bringing his rebound numbers up by learning to use his body and angles better (as his greatest skill in rebounding has previously been instinct and tenacity and he could make some major strides in rebounding fundamentals).

That's my hope anyway. He can really only be one or the other, though.

That's a lot of range. Some will take major exception, but I agree ..

 

[NCJazz]

That's a lot of range. Some will take major exception, but I agree ..

I am sorry, but i will trust my own eyes last year. Millsap got destroyed on the defensive end last year. His effort on the defensive end is definitely down from what it used to be. I certainly still like him as a 6th-7th man who gets a lot minutes against teams who go small.

 

[Jazz4ever]

I am sorry, but i will trust my own eyes last year. Millsap got destroyed on the defensive end last year. His effort on the defensive end is definitely down from what it used to be. I certainly still like him as a 6th-7th man who gets a lot minutes against teams who go small.

If he got destroyed on defense then the only other explanation is his incredible offense and intangibles accounted for those lofty ratings. Take your pick.

 

[InGameStrategy]

I've honestly never understood the "too-short" allegations. I mean come on, some of the alltime best power forwards are considered "short" by todays standards.

Oh, so easy to refute.

Dennis Rodman was 6'6",

Rodman's job was to be Jordan's thug--get in the game, push people around, annoy them, and score only garbage points. By contrast, the discussion of Jefferson and Millsap presumes that most people are looking for these players to be good all-around players0--scorers and defenders alike. Their salaries support that notion.

Charles Barkley was anwhere from 6'4" to 6'6" and theyre both considered one fo the best at their respective positions, especially rodman in terms of defense.

LOL; Rodman was among the best defensive forwards.

That's like saying that Bruce Bowen was among the best defensive wings.

Or maybe that Jefferson is currently one of the best offensive centers.

In each case, it implies a player who might be valuable in a subsidiary role but not a cornerstone.

That's why the question of whether Jefferson can (and will) play defense regularly is a relevant one; it's arguably the difference between whether he's a rich-man's role player or a franchise player (i.e., top 1, 2 or maybe 3 in importance).

 

[spycam1]

I think we can all agree that Kanter and Favors both have the potential to be much better than Millsap and we should hope that they are the future PF and C of this team. That being said, I still think, whether he improves any more or not, Millsap is a great sixth man. Not only is his style of play more suited to come off the bench at this point, but his salary is also ideal for a sixth man.

Can you imagine if Kanter and Favors both live up to their potential (20/10 guys) AND we have a seasoned Millsap coming off the bench? That's one scary front court; a front court I think the Jazz should be aiming for.

 

[Jazz4ever]

I think we can all agree that Kanter and Favors both have the potential to be much better than Millsap and we should hope that they are the future PF and C of this team. That being said, I still think, whether he improves any more or not, Millsap is a great sixth man. Not only is his style of play more suited to come off the bench at this point, but his salary is also ideal for a sixth man.

Can you imagine if Kanter and Favors both live up to their potential (20/10 guys) AND we have a seasoned Millsap coming off the bench? That's one scary front court; a front court I think the Jazz should be aiming for.

Now if we can only convince the players and owners to compromise on that hard cap so we can begin the journey