Wow. Cougar fans aren't going to like this......

[bigb]

perhaps it was BYU that rebuffed a possible invite because they didn't want to agree to conditions mandated by the Pac 10?


if that possibility has been discussed already, I apologize - I didn't see it.

also, I think some of you are overestimating the idea that BYU has this huge "national following" - - yeah, there are LDS folks across the US, and many of them are going to be BYU fans, but many of them will also be fans of whatever school is in their region or state, or whatever school they personally attended, and at any rate, I think it's probably a pretty small percentage of the population in most other parts of the country other than Utah and a few other areas.

Here's a pie chart showing % of religious affiliation for the midwest:

Mormon is 0.4 % - that's a pretty trivial number compared to the other religions listed.
https://www.religionatlas.org/religion_region/MIDWEST.htm

I don't know if I would use the term "national fanbase". I know it's been used over and over again. I think most Mormons from across the country would pay attention to them and cheer for them, unless they were playing the school they actually attended. They will follow BYU whether they went there or not. I get the same impression a lot of Catholics do the same with Notre Dame, but I may be wrong.

 

[Duck Rodgers]

Bottom line on academics, BYU realizes most grad degrees are completely worthless and focuses their attention on undergrad. Now that's a smart school.

 

[SaltyDawg]

I don't know if I would use the term "national fanbase". I know it's been used over and over again. I think most Mormons from across the country would pay attention to them and cheer for them, unless they were playing the school they actually attended. They will follow BYU whether they went there or not. I get the same impression a lot of Catholics do the same with Notre Dame, but I may be wrong.

I am a Catholic, and my whole family is as well. None of us are Notre Dame fans. I also know several Baptists, and not a single one is a Baylor fan.

I think most people keep their religion and sports seperate.

The reason Notre Dame is such a big name with a huge fanbase is because they are on tv every week. Not only that, but up until Alabama won the championship last year, Notre Dame had the most all time champioinships. So you put a team on national tv every week, have them win the championship more often than any other team, and they are bound to get a pretty good sized fanbase. It doesn't have anything to do with religion.

Notre Dame is like the Lakers, Yankees, Cowboys, etc. The fanbase is huge, but it isn't because of religion.

I have already pointed out that I know plenty of LDS who aren't BYU fans (just take a look at the stands at any Ute home game and you will see thousands, within 40 minutes of the BYU campus). So I think it's pretty ridiculous to assume that just because someone is of a particular faith, that they will root for a particular football team. Sure some people will, but the majority of people don't.

 

[CONAN]

just for the sake of comparison...




so they have a separate tuition tier based on religious affiliation? well geez yeah, that would seem to be a big disqualifier.

Yup.

 

[CONAN]

One thing is for sure, hype for this year's game and the game itself should be insane . . . clearly.

 

[Stifle Tower]

just for the sake of comparison...




so they have a separate tuition tier based on religious affiliation? well geez yeah, that would seem to be a big disqualifier.

Yes, but also note members of the LDS faith generally believe in the principle of tithing - i.e. donating 10% of their income to the Church each year. So LDS students - and their parents - will have paid the difference between LDS/non-LDS tuition many times over in their lifetime.

 

[CONAN]

Yes, but also note members of the LDS faith generally believe in the principle of tithing - i.e. donating 10% of their income to the Church each year. So LDS students - and their parents - will have paid the difference between LDS/non-LDS tuition many times over in their lifetime.

This is true. But I can still understand why it wouldn't jive with the Pac-10 constitution and why the Pac-10 might be opening itself up for a lawsuit if it took on BYU.

 

[Scat]

This is true. But I can still understand why it wouldn't jive with the Pac-10 constitution and why the Pac-10 might be opening itself up for a lawsuit if it took on BYU.

I don't see how it differs greatly from a school charging less for in state students vs out of state or even out of country students. It's a criteria that the school has set up for students that want to attend and they don't hide the fact. Obviously there are those that are willing to pay the extra money to attend the school of their choice.

 

[G-O-A-T]

But I can still understand why it wouldn't jive with the Pac-10 constitution and why the Pac-10 might be opening itself up for a lawsuit if it took on BYU.

Does the Pac-10 constitution contain a clause that expressly forbids religiously affiliated universities from joining?

I'm not familiar with Pac-10 constitution but I'm sure there's something in there about discriminatory tuition with regards to religion.

Oh... OK, thanks for pointing out that statement was nothing more than a baseless allegation of fact.

I'm fine with BYU not being in the Pac-10. Not a big deal really. But call it whatever you want whether that be a business decision or bigotry or whatever but the bottom line is academics has very little to do with BYU not being there. We all know it's about religion whether you haters want to admit to it or not. In fact, if BYU wasn't a Mormon school I doubt a lot of you haters would even exist.

Just go ahead and keep telling yourself this was a purely religious based decision... it had nothing to do with Utah's recent superior athletic program or research academia... it's all religious bigotry

You know, if you just replaced the word "religion" with "race" and the word "Mormon" with "Pro African-American" you could be

 

[moevillini]

just wondering...

IF BYU were invited to join the Pac 10 Conference, would they accept?


as much as some of you BYU fans might think it'd be the best course of action, I wouldn't necessarily assume that the university and church hierarchy would feel it would be beneficial for the school to join the conference.


those of you who claim it's due to "religious discrimination" on the part of the Pac 10 that is keeping BYU out of the conference, how about BYU's own practices of religious discriination? I think that's the deal killer right there - - after all these years, I've finally looked up the BYU Honor Code, here it is:

https://saas.byu.edu/catalog/2009-2010ucat/GeneralInfo/HonorCode.php#HCOfficeInvovement

...Members of the faculty, administration, staff, and student body at BYU, BYU—Hawaii, BYU—Idaho, and LDSBC are selected and retained from among those who voluntarily live the principles of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Observance of such is a specific condition of employment and admission. Those individuals who are not members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints are also expected to maintain the same standards of conduct, except church attendance...

 

[Hopper]

What is it about the honor code that you find "discriminatory," exactly, eh, Mo?

 

[CONAN]

I don't see how it differs greatly from a school charging less for in state students vs out of state or even out of country students. It's a criteria that the school has set up for students that want to attend and they don't hide the fact. Obviously there are those that are willing to pay the extra money to attend the school of their choice.

It's based on religion. Again, not familiar with Pac-10 constitution but I'm sure there's something in there about religious discrimination.

 

[CONAN]

it had nothing to do with Utah's recent superior athletic program or research academia

Not talking about Utah here, Sport.

 

[CONAN]

just wondering...

IF BYU were invited to join the Pac 10 Conference, would they accept?

Who knows? Not a big deal either way. But then again, BYU isn't as crazy for the limelight as Utah is. Little Bro is feeling it for the first time ever. Get some!

those of you who claim it's due to "religious discrimination" on the part of the Pac 10 that is keeping BYU out of the conference, how about BYU's own practices of religious discriination?

Exactly, and that's why I haven't cried foul here based on religious discrimination. It's just smart business by the Pac-10.

 

[Bronco70]

how about BYU's own practices of religious discriination?

Looks to me like being Mormon isn't necessary, just abiding by their (BYU's) code of conduct. You're stretching here, Moe.

 

[Hopper]

Looks to me like being Mormon isn't necessary, just abiding by their (BYU's) code of conduct. You're stretching here, Moe.

Don't even hafta have no religious faith, best I can tell, eh, Bronc? But, then again, looky here: they want them "who voluntarily live the principles of the gospel of Jesus Christ." If ya wasn't some kinda biblical scholar, or sumthin, how would ya even know what that means, exactly?

My own damn self, I aint never known nobuddy, christian or not, who "turns the other cheek" when sumbuddy tries to bitch-slap em, so, like, who would even be eligible at all, I wonder?

 

[Jeditiger]

BYU can wither and die in the MWC for all I care. Good riddance to them and the MWC.

 

[Bronco70]

Don't even hafta have no religious faith, best I can tell, eh, Bronc? But, then again, looky here: they want them "who voluntarily live the principles of the gospel of Jesus Christ." If ya wasn't some kinda biblical scholar, or sumthin, how would ya even know what that means, exactly?

Read carefully:

Those individuals who are not members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints are also expected to maintain the same standards of conduct, except church attendance...

I didn't see anything about faith. I'm seeing "conduct".

 

[Stifle Tower]

Looks to me like being Mormon isn't necessary, just abiding by their (BYU's) code of conduct. You're stretching here, Moe.

I suspect other religious schools have similar standards of conduct required by their faculty. Do you think a professor who gives students extra credit for hot tub parties at his house and homsexual encounters as part of his course on "Human Sexuality" would be a tenured professor at say, Oral Roberts (and yes, I know there's a pun in there).

Real case from back in the 90's, BTW. I was living in No. CA and the story was big news. The only "discipline" the UC-Berkeley (you knew it had to be that school) professor received was that he was prohibited from giving extra credit for the parties at his house.

Oh, and BTW, these classes were taught all the way up through 2002. Orgies, trips to strip clubs, guest lectures by adult-film stars, watching the professor have sex...all while earning 1-4 credits. Yep, gotta love those free-thinkers at UCB, the AAU for accrediting the university and the Pac-10 for turning a blind eye (or maybe not...perhaps the commissioners were invited along as well).

Unfortunately for students, nowadays you can still take the classes, but the field trips have been cancelled. Damn budget crisis!

https://www.sunwayco.com/sex.html

 

[Hopper]

Read carefully:



I didn't see anything about faith. I'm seeing "conduct".

Yeah, that's what I done said, too.